"The mark of an immature man is that he would die knobly for a cause. The mark of a mature man is that he would live humbly for one" - Catcher in the Rye -WARNING WRITER SPELLING CHALLENGED! But Sometimes you have to say "what the fuck!"

Friday, June 25, 2004

If I'm in charge and I treat you like a child Will you let yourself go wild? Let my mouth go where it wants to? -Madonna

The word lesbian doesn't quite describe the sexual
curiosity women today have about one another.
They are like each other's archeological dig,
in which the excavation of genitals, breasts,
the taste of skin is where they look to find what is
missing in their lives, something men cannot give them
.
Nancy Friday, The Power of Beauty

Erotica - Madonna
Erotica, romance (repeat)
My name is Dita
I'll be your mistress tonight
I'd like to put you in a trance

If I take you from behind
Push myself into your mind
When you least expect it
Will you try and reject it
If I'm in charge and I treat you like a child
Will you let yourself go wild
Let my mouth go where it wants to

Give it up, do as I say
Give it up and let me have my way
I'll give you love, I'll hit you like a truck
I'll give you love, I'll teach you how to ...

I'd like to put you in a trance, all over
Erotic, erotic, put your hands all over my body (repeat twice)
Erotic, erotic

Once you put your hand in the flame
You can never be the same
There's a certain satisfaction
In a little bit of pain
I can see you understand
I can tell that you're the same
If you're afraid, well rise above
I only hurt the ones I love

Give it up, do as I say
Give it up and let me have my way
I'll give you love, I'll hit you like a truck
I'll give you love, I'll teach you how to ...

I'd like to put you in a trance, all over
Erotic, erotic, put your hands all over my body (repeat twice)
Erotic, erotic

Erotica, romance
I'd like to put you in a trance
Erotica, romance
Put your hands all over my body

I don't think you know what pain is
I don't think you've gone that way
I could bring you so much pleasure
I'll come to you when you say
I know you want me
I'm not gonna hurt you
I'm not gonna hurt you, just close your eyes

Erotic, erotic (repeat several times)
Put your hands all over my body
All over me, all over me

Erotica, [give it up, give it up] romance
I'd like to put you in a trance
Erotica, [give it up, give it up] romance
I like to do a different kind of
Erotica, [give it up, give it up] romance
I'd like to put you in a trance
Erotica, romance
Put your hands all over my body

Only the one that hurts you can make you feel better
Only the one that inflicts pain can take it away

Eroti - ca

Growing up in the age of Madonna
When I was about 13, I wanted to be Madonna “I wanna, I wanna, I wanna be Madonna”. Madonna came out with her song “Holiday” and I about flipped, then, when I saw her video “Borderline” I was in love. She was everything I wanted to be; sassy, beautiful, mouthy, liberated and one hell of a cool dresser. I emulated her style with the lace gloves, rosary jewelry, black rubber bracelets, tube minni skirts, and a black bra with white lace tank top. I memorized her songs, her lyrics, her dance moves, and even lusted after Sean Penn when she was with him. She was the epitome of a sexually liberated 80’s chick; humping a stage at the VMAs in a wedding dress cooing "Like a Virgin", and a few years later, seducing a sexy black Jesus while gospel choirs belted "Like a Prayer." She was the It girl, and I wanted to be just like her.

Madonna and Bi-sexuality
I wonder how growing up in the age of Madonna effects a girls sexual image? I saw Madonna as strong, beautiful, sex object, businesswoman, masturbator, fashion plate and bi-sexual. Madonna made out with other women in public, including Sandra Bernhardt and Naomi Campbell (most recently Brittany Spears). Madonna didn’t care if other people called her trash, she aimed to push the envelope, challenge norms, and break taboos.

My How to Be Bisexual Degree
I admit the bi-sexual thing intrigued me, but I never really thought about it much until I attended UC Berkeley and entered the Women Studies program. I now jokingly call this my “How to be bi-sexual” degree. When I started at Cal I was just coming out of a bad marriage and I really wasn’t ready for sexual relations of any kind. But the things I saw, and heard about, would blow my mind and shatter images for years to come.

Women Studies at Cal
Women studies isn’t a bunch of man-haters, like one would think; its basically a bunch of liberal arts students studying all collegiate aspects from a “female” perspective. There are classes on Freudian theory, history of women in the US, anthropological studies of gender, socialization of gender, images of gender in film, women contributions to literature and art, etc. It was a great program, and taught by world renowned scholars. I definitely found myself in this program. There actually were a few males in most of the classes, and some even decided to major or minor in the program.

Manic-Panicked looks
Women in the program were a myriad of types and personalities. There were some that looked like Donna of 90210, fresh out of So Cal, with blond hair and preppy clothes. Others had that hippie girl look; hairy legs and armpits, flowing dresses, no makeup, and wild flowing hair. Some girls cultivated the riot grrrl look with black combat boots, black clothing, punked out hair and tattoos. Mostly, girls just looked like typical college students, with shorts, t-shirts, backpacks, and maybe the occasional Birkenstock. I kinda went for the punk look, preferring to wear my doc martins with short summer dresses and manic-panicked colored hair. We were all different; there definitely was no stereotype in the looks department. Some of us wore make up and shaved (like me) other were all natural, and felt makeup and other feminine markings were the “tools of the oppressor”. Yes, there were some lesbian students, Hell Berkeley had classes on gay and lesbian studies, female sexuality, and I think there was one called “the power of the vagina”. One lesbian student I remember had wild curly hair, piercing blue eyes, and like to sport shirts that read “men cant live with them… don’t have too” with a big rainbow triangle. She especially liked to wear this around Greek row.

Bi-sexual trend
What I noticed was most popular around women studies students, wasn’t a common style or belief system. Most popular among women studies students was the self title “bi-sexual”. Shit, it seemed EVERYONE claimed to be bi-sexual, married, girls with boyfriends, single chicks, you name it. My best friend at Berkeley, who claimed to have slept with over 75 guys, took on the “title” of bi-sexual soon after starting college. I remember her saying to me “I just want to see what being with a girl is like”, I don’t know if she was coming onto me or what, I just know at that time I was too sexually repressed to even think about that. She later had a “coming out” experience with the curly haired lesbian in one of the professors office after hours. She attended “women only” hot-tub parties, and safe sex performances by this SF troop called the safe sex sluts who demonstrated on live volunteers how to use dental dams, gloves, etc. She would tell me about these adventures and I would act all shocked but get excited and intrigued secretly inside. She went on to have threesomes and other bisexual fun and of course is now married to some guy and expecting kids.

Bi-sexual Berkeley Babes

I had some other “bi-sexual” girlfriends that I would hang out with. These girls grew up in Berkeley, where being bisexual was the rage, though they had multiple boyfriends, I guess they did some messing around with each other as teenagers, or whenever they were lonely or bored. This one girl F and I used to go clubbing and dancing together around Berkeley. We would get on the dance floor and start freakin each other. We would be rubbin our bodies together, feeling each other up, and get real “lesbo”. We would also go to Fetish clubs in full on bondage gear in SF, and spank each other, make out, and rub up against each other. This was mainly for “show” as we liked the reaction we would get from the boys. This was about as far as I ever got with a girl. I did have one hot bi-sexual chick pick up on me really hard while I was going out with J. It wasn’t until my boyfriend J that I became sexually liberated, and this was my senior year at Cal. This was my first major relationship after my marriage, and I was totally into lovin and sexing this man. This really super hot chick, with a perfect body, dark hair and big doe eyes would always come onto me when we ran into each other. She would tell J “Im gonna steal your girlfriend”. I was so flattered, as she had been the object of love and lust in a famous rock song of that time. One time, I was drunk off cider and beer (snakebite) at a Berkeley pub and she took me into a dark closet where we held each other real close for about 30 minutes. J ended coming in and busting up the scene, but I always wonder what would have happened. She is married with kids now too.

Now days, girls who claim to be bi-sexual seem to be following in a growing trend. According to this article in Florida’s Sun Senital .

Trendy Bi-sexual grrrls
It's not an unusual scene, according to South Florida high school students, who say the newest trend for teen girls isn't wearing the latest designer jeans or driving a cool car, but declaring themselves to be bisexual.

"Some do it for attention. Some do it because guys like it. And some do it just because they can. It's definitely a fad," says Stranahan High student Christy Shalley, president of the Fort Lauderdale school's Gay Straight Alliance.


Ms. Nancy Friday
One of my favorite authors on sexuality is Nancy Friday. She writes books on women’s fantasies, my two favorites being “Women on Top” and “My Secret Garden”. It seems that many women, bored housewives etc fantasize about being with other women.

According to Ms. Friday “The percentage of women claiming to be bi-sexual and or lesbian in real life has risen steadily in recent years; also, the number of women who fantasize about other women has soared. I could comment at great length regarding how traditionally and comfortably women have had erotic dreams about other women since I began my research 25 years ago.”

Nancy Friday website

Its the End of the World as we Know it... and I feel fine....I wonder does this make us all bi-sexual? Is it really common for us to fantasize about other women? I must admit, I’m not attracted to the bull-dyke lesbian types. They don’t do it for me at all. But the Angelina Jolie, Halle Berry types…. YOWZA! They rock my fantasy world. Would I ever really “do it” with a chick? Or is this just a fantasy? I can tell you, that I really LOVE men, and I don’t think I could ever live without a nice hard cock. Its also that yin/yang thing, feminine/masculine… I like having an opposite. I dunno, maybe its just a masturbation fantasy, maybe it will never happen. Or maybe its something I would do for a man, so he could watch and later join? Im not sure…I just wonder how many of us actually think about it?

If we grow up feeling that there is something
wrong with what lies between our legs,
we will not just see that place as repugnant, a sewer,
The Cloaca that we can never make beautiful,
but we assume that like the ugly birthmark on a leg
or arm, this is what people see when they look at us.

—Nancy Friday, The Power of Beauty

Another quote I stole off the internet.

Women are at a stage in history where they are truly coming into their own - financially, socially, and sexually. Women have more disposable income, careers, extended reproductive lives, and are more confident and secure than they ever have been before. In many respects, this is the direct result of the feminist movement, which was the impetus of many developments that are now considered social norms.
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77 comments:

jp said...

I don't have anything to say at this point...I just wanted to be the first post. :op

The Dave said...

Damn girl... that was a long ass entry, bi-sexual trendiness? What next? Kids today... It's important to remember that women are beautiful & soft, and girl girl action should whole heartedly be supported in the arts, which includes private video collections.

Sorry to bring the level of your discussion down so low so quick... but, y'know whatever.

David said...

Hey everyone, look! More theatrics! Vadergrrrl, have you ever considered producing television shows for the FOX network?

>>>>>Too hot for TV?
>>>>>When animals attack?
>>>>>Worlds sexiest traffic stops?
>>>>>Jerry Springer Uncut?

Vadergrrrl said...

Damn JP - you speechless.... thats a first.. LOL

The Dave - yes, girl on girl action in film is nice, and I hear more rewarding for the actors

David - Dont HATE, congradulate! Whats wrong with being like Madonna anyway? Theatrics? Well that is what makes the world go around... How do you change the world without pushing some buttons...

Vadergrrrl said...

Another thing David, I dont see how discussion sexual liberation and women is "Shocking" or Jerry Springer like. I hate to say you are being sexist, but Dude, why dont you re-read my post without you heterosexist, bitter and burned baggage? I dont think my post is shocking as much as it is explanitory and inquisitive.
-Embrace your feminine side David....

jp said...
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jp said...
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jp said...
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jp said...

Well, I wasn't speechless, I just hadn't had time to read the whole post yet.

I'd love to take that "Power of the Vag" course but, alas, I wouldn't fit in at Berkeley as I was never, and will never be, bisexual. :)

jp said...

Holy shit, your comment link went absolutely batshit there. :)

Avuncular 1 said...

If you look on the copyright page of Dave Eggers, "A Heartbreaking Work of Staggering Genius" you will see that he has a scale of 1-10. Let me see if I remember correctly...1 being absolutely straight and 10 being absolutely gay. Eggers gave himself a 3. I believe most people fall somewhere between 1 and 10 with actually few 1's and 10's around (although I'm sure they exist). -->Be careful! This is one of those topics where the more you deny, the more you look like you are!
However, there are a lot of people who say they are more bi, or gay than they are so that they can be fashionable. (See Ewan McGregor's little rant in the beginning of "Velvet Goldmine.")
Have more to say but have to go do a friend a favor.
-Later

Avuncular 1 said...

If you look on the copyright page of Dave Eggers, "A Heartbreaking Work of Staggering Genius" you will see that he has a scale of 1-10. Let me see if I remember correctly...1 being absolutely straight and 10 being absolutely gay. Eggers gave himself a 3. I believe most people fall somewhere between 1 and 10 with actually few 1's and 10's around (although I'm sure they exist). -->Be careful! This is one of those topics where the more you deny, the more you look like you are!
However, there are a lot of people who say they are more bi, or gay than they are so that they can be fashionable. (See Ewan McGregor's little rant in the beginning of "Velvet Goldmine.")
Have more to say but have to go do a friend a favor.
-Later

Gooch said...

A couple years ago I was at a club in Laguna. These two very attractive young ladies were dancing together and kept squeezing each others boobs.

All I could think was, "Thank you Mom and Dad for having me at such a good time in American history".

By the way - was the pub "Kips". That's the only place in Berkeley that I remember selling Snakebite. They also had a real liberal ID policy, which was nice in high school.

Michael said...

I had a gf, born and raised in S.Cal, with all the self-esteem baggage that often come with it, despite how attractive she was. She'd go to clubs w/her friends, feel insecure compared to the other hotties there, so she would do the lesbo dance with her friends to top the other girls and get the guys' attention. Strange thing was, after a while, she started to really enjoy it. Hmmmm.... I tell ya, Vadergrrrl, between this thought and your excellent post about lesbianism... I may have to take a break to embark on yesterday's post topic....

Inanna said...

As a female who has had girl-on-girl action, I still in no way consider myself bi-sexual. I'm not even curious anymore. To me, its just another expression of sexuality. Bi-sexual to me means that I would be willing to have a relationship with another woman, which I did when I was very young, before losing my virginity to a man, and its just not for me. I, like Vader, need the yin/yang, opposite fit, masculine/feminine to be truly fulfilled in a sexual relationship or a relationship of any kind. No, toys and strap-ons don't get it. Its something much deeper than sex. I'll shut up now but great post Vader!!

Greg said...

We need video...

Vader Gone Wild!

Pup said...

I've got to stop reading these posts at work... or at least be able to go to the bathroom without walking pass 12 women.
This is such a hot post. Not because you're talking about girl on girl action either (not that it hurts), but the fact that women (you) can be secure and liberated enough to discuss your feelings about this topic. It's so refreshing.
That makes you so hot!!!

Cootera said...

Ah hell... I gotta get in on this action, too. If ya feel it, it's natural. Whether you're discussing masturbation, same sex get-it-ons, fantasies, what have you. But as far as girl/girl goes, I'm sure we've ALL thought about it. I, like Vader, love the boys. There's no way around it. But that doesn't stop me from appreciating the beauty in other people, whether they're women, gay men, hermaphrodites... It really just plain doesn't matter what you see in others. The only difference is that some people are more willing to act on it than others. More power to 'em.

David said...

sexism NOUN

(actions based on) the belief that the members of one sex are less intelligent, able, skilful, etc. than the members of the other sex, especially that women are less able than men:

Nope... said nothing of the sort.
Melodramatic (see definition 2 for synonym theatrical)

Definition: [adj] having the excitement and emotional appeal of melodrama; "a melodramatic account of two perilous days at sea"
[adj] characteristic of acting or a stage performance; often affected; "histrionic gestures"; "an attitude of melodramatic despair"; "a theatrical pose"

Sounds like it's not me that isn't reading...

Vadergrrrl said...

YEs, but you are very bitter and burned. I love ya David, but your Skully like critism and elitism is a little trying sometimes.
-Like I said Embrace your feminine side... Love your internal goddess.... its liberating to be free...
xoxoxox

Vadergrrrl said...

One more thing, since I do love a good argument...
What the hell is wrong with being melodramatic? Being an uptight stiff with a stick up your ass is no fun.

NotCuredYet said...

Wow! Bi-women everywhere? The irony is that if I'd been less into my own fantasy world and more into connecting with reality, I probably could have actually hooked up with some bi's and fulfilled my fantasies.

Interesting take on this fashionable trend.

Oz said...

At first I was going to tell you to head on out and get some hot chick action. Then I remembered your description of chicks in your area (fat, flannel, bad hair) and decided you should probably stay away. I mean, Sailortown/Redneckville doesn't sound like it's crawling with bisexuals and lesbians. Ooooh, but maybe you'll get lucky and a hot Navy chick will wander across your path....

As an aside, I hate it when girls claim to be bisexual, and then I say, Really? Tell me about it. And they've never even kissed another girl. Come on! Then I guess I'm into men!

Vadergrrrl said...

Excuse the little tift with David there... Im always up for a good rant with a friend... -luv ya David..

-JP I think you would definately be "up" for the power of the vag class. LOL

-The Dastard. Great point. I read some feminist scholar who wrote on the "lesbian continuam" with that same theory. Sexuality is like a specrum. Very good point.

-Gooch. TOo funny, Im glad you enjoyed the show. THe bar in Berkeley was actually in Albany, and it was called the Mallard.

-Michael. Sounds like me and my friends. LOL. HOpe you had fun in the bathroom too.

Inanna - great post as always. I think many little girls experiment, that is totally natural.

Greg- THe video is comming.

Pup - sorry to get you worked up at work. Keep it Up (pun intended)

Ang- your posts always kick ass. Glad you jumped in here.

Not Cured Yet - keep getting help, though I dont think you need any. LOL

Vadergrrrl said...

I also wounder about the "trend" in calling yourself Bi. I think we are all bi-curious, but come on, self imposed, trendy titles are just that.
-I like the point the Dastard brought up here on the continuam (sp I SUCK AT SPELLING). We ALL are somewhere between 1 and 10. We all have fantasies, etc. Its just some of us are willing to explore them, some of us just think about it, and for some of us, it is a choice, or a lifestyle and who you are.
Thanks Oz for the great comment as always.

jp said...

My favorite comment on this subject is by the late, great Sam Kinison - "It's been said that every man has a homsexual fantasy. Sooooooo, I'm sitting around the house one day thinkin. Because, if it's in there, I WANT IT OUT!!!" :o)

Avuncular 1 said...

I have known people that fantasized about same-sex Shenanigans but have never acted on them, or like to watch said action on video. That's cool. Sometimes fantasies should stay fantasies. There are a lot of people out there that are neither equiped, nor emotionally ready, to live out their fantasies without being majorly damaged or damaging (it happens enough in hetero relationships I know). But if you want to go for it, go for it.

Everyone should read "Savage Love" if they don't already.

One more thing: mmmmmm......girl-on-girl action.

zephyr said...

I love this post. I, too, have been attracted to Angelina Jolie & Halle Berry - although most of my *ahem* experiences with girls have not been with ones so beautiful. Check out the movie "The Sex Monster" with Merial Hemmingway. Another one of my "crushes". : )

David said...

Dear, there's no arguement... I said something about your post... you said I didn't read it... I showed you the definition of the word, and now you say "what's wrong with that?"

I realize you are saying something like ""Reality" is the only word in the language that should always be used in quotes", but nevertheless... there's leather, and there's pleather.... fur, and faux fur... people, and cardboard cut outs...

So out of all those things, which ones are acting?

Jack said...

Man, I wish I'd gone to college. I think I would've been interested in some of those classes. But, then, I think grrls kick ass.

What song was she featured in? Which one, which one, which one?

It does seem to just be a trend that more women and girls call themselves bi. It doesn't bother me, though. I think it's good to explore and celebrate your sex at that age.

PunkAssBitch said...

Is it still considered "trendy" if you actually HAVE had a same sex experience? I mean, more than french kissing your girl-friend for shock value of the guys in the bar? and more than one time, with more than just ONE woman?

I never enjoyed being called a trendy...it was always used in such a slur fashion (back in the days when Madonna was THE shit! LOL)

...BUT....

I *do* call myself Bi, and never did that until I actually DID dive in (without pluggin' my nose even!) and went beyond just kising...licked, sucked, nibbled, rubbed, fingered, and CAME...and had the same favors returned upon me by another (and incredibly HOT) woman. More than once, and more than with just one woman (not at the same time, but there's always another day!)

and I'd love to (nay, CRAVE) to do it again and again and again.

I'm a married with children grrl...thankfully I'm married to a guy that is totally OKAY with me doing these things...sure, he'd love to participate or at least be able to watch....but it doesn't always work out that way.

I don't call myself a lesbian, because I really enjoy penis way too much to give it up completely...Ying & Yang thing. Besides that, when I want a woman, I want a WOMAN. Soft, sensual, squishy in all the right places...delicious.

damn...now I gotta go pet my kitty ;-p

PunkAssBitch said...

oops...one more thing....even Madonna's (um, Esther?) married with children now...but I wonder if the Kabballah has put the Kabash down on her Bi-sexual tendencies?

LOL...okay....NOW I'm off to go pet my kitty!

Vadergrrrl said...

JP - Sam Kinesen always had the best comments. However I know he was a big fan of girl on girl action.

Dastard - Savage Love? Will have to check that book out. Another good author is the guy who wrote Rules of Attraction and Less than Zero. Anne Rice of course is another sure thing, great read.

Melanie - I will check that movie out. Rember the scene in "the Hunger". mmmmmm vampires...

David - I would NEVER be scene is a real fur - Furs should be worn ONLY by animals. Pleather is cool too, as I dont eat cows, and really shouldnt be wearing them. xoxoxoxoxo

Jack - cant tell you the song or the band, cuz then I would be name dropping. Its a poppy punk band from Berkeley that I used to hang around with.

PunkAssBitch - you are the coolest. I think Im in luv with ya! I agree its not a fad, its a preference. I think its way cool that you can be married and still be allowed to play out fantasies. I hope one day to be in a relationship with a man like that too.
-PS have fun with your kitty... meow!

jp said...

Well, I'm a fan of girl-on-girl action too. However, I had to stop watching Six Feet Under because of all the dude-on-dude action.

Vadergrrrl said...

JP - Embrace your feminine side.... Try watching Queer Eye for the Straight Guy and Showtime sometime too.

Why is it that guys can watch girl on girl action but not two guys kissing? What is up with that?

Girls can handle girl on girl action. Why are guys so queesy? Is it that they get a little aroused, excited, maybe even stimulated?

Please advise? Inquiring minds want to know.

TheSugarV said...

Fad or no fad, it does not really matter, in my opinion at least. I believe that if something has become a "fad" it is society’s way of opening its mind to possibilities that were once thought to be nonexistent. It does not necessarily mean acceptance of the idea but a quasi-understanding, a pseudo-tolerance of sorts. The fact that women want to try to be with other women speaks for itself. Meaning that they understand what they are doing and are just breaking through their innate and timid barriers that they have set up. The question then becomes: If no one in the world would ever know or find out about your sexual adventure would you still do it? If you answer no, then you are probably (but not necessarily) not attracted to or do not want to be with women. If yes it does not necessarily mean you are a lesbian but maybe it means you wanted to try something, like trying a food on a menu that you have never heard of before. It may be good or bad but you do not know until you try it and the adventure of trying or the open mindedness of trying something is the freedom that you are looking for. It is a freedom that everyone has, some more than others. I believe it is a freedom you have to explore at your own pace. But what do I know…It just my thoughts.

Tricia said...

Ahhh,
you are stirring up the shit now!

I can tell you that girl on girl is fun... if you're just bi-curious, but I have been chased by hard core lesbians and it wasn't even erotic.

Wendy... is the water warm?
Yes Lisa.

Much prefer the intimacy and touching than getting fucked by a woman... just like a man.
If I wanted that... I'd just fuck a man!
Ya know!

jp said...

I can honestly tell you that I don't get aroused. For some reason, girl on girl looks more NATURAL to me than two dudes goin at it.

And I'm not a homophobe. My brother is flaming and I love him like he's well...my brother. :o)

Vadergrrrl said...

SugarV - great post. Something to think about. I still think fantasy and reality can be very separate. But hey, didnt know I liked Sushi until I tried it and loved it. lol

Tricia - bulldyke types really dont do it for me either. If I wanted a manly type, I would just go for a man. They seem to always like me though, and get upset when they see me off with some cute young boy.... oh well..

JP - Six feet under is a great show. I dunno, I think two guys making out is really sexy. One of my exboyfriends used to like to suck on one of my life-like dildos and this would drive me wild. Dont ask me why, but it did. He is probably bi or gay, who knows. I think you should try sucking on a dildo too, who knows, maybe you will like it... just like SUSHI! LOL

Aimee said...

I suppose labels are convenient. I prefer to think of it in terms of "in this relationship, my heart went out to a (man) / (woman)". 'Cause really, if it's about more than just sex, if it's about love, then how does your heart know what gender the other heart is?

At least that's what's always worked for me....

I could never give up penises--too much like lollipops, and I love my candy (giggle), but I could never give up soft, tasty, girls either, they feel & smell WAY too good.

Gotta go watch a movie now. Bye.

Michael said...

Vadergrrrl, thanks for all the loin-stirring controversial posts and comments. You made my week, baby. Have a good weekend, y'all.

Varla said...

Hey hot stuff, did you write this one for me? =)
Seriously, the bisexual thing. I'm surrounded by women (and men) who truly are bisexual. I also get frustrated when searching through personals or at parties to meet a bisexual girl, only to realize there are a lot of women that call themselves that, but have had no experience...
UGh, which is understandable - it can be a scary thing - but it's frustrating feeling like you have to be the one to 'turn them out'...
Sorry for the rant! That's just my $.02...
Thanks for your comment girl - you rock my world...=)

Tricia said...

Okay, your saying girl on girl erotica okay! Bulldyke bad!

So whats your address! heehee


Sorry couldn't resist... you know we all love our Vadergrrrrl!

JP... I think most hetero men find the thought of being penetrated... even by a woman, offensive.

Jenn said...

Vadergrrrl,
Why wouldn't women want to be with women? We know where to touch each other, we know what feels good and what doesn't, we are soft and yeilding, and you never have to be trained to figure it out cause we have the same parts. Women just no how to please each other. I have to agree the bull dike women scare me, but there are women that I am attracted to, don't think I would ever go there again, but yeah it was good, as good as sex with men and a lot less work to get what you need.

Andy said...

Wow! Long post, very in depth :p

Jack said...

Very interesting and thought provoking post. You continue to surprise me.

And I know this is gonna ruffle some feathers but...Madonna? She has always been more popular than talented, yet never relevant. Another psuedo-celebrity who has built a career on re-inventing herself into whatever "edgy" persona would raise the most eyebrows. An inspiration to Britney Spears, who should start calling herself Mini-Madonna. Someone needs to break the news to her (and while we're at it, Cher) that her fifteen minutes of fame has been up. Like about 1987.

Tricia said...

Jack you know if Madonna, Cher and Brittney did a girl on girl video it would sell like hotcakes!
I'd stand in line for that one! LOL

Vadergrrrl said...

Hi Aimee - Labels can be a bad thing, your so right. It shouldnt be about man/woman, it should be my partner at the time. Very good point. I also agree that I can never give up the penis (well the hot kind with veins and real cum). I just love the taste, smell, feeling inside... I dont think I could ever give that up. I also like the strenght of men. Drives me crazy... Thanks for rubbing it in that you have a life besides the computer. Im geekin out here tonight. Oh well, got wine, got smokes... and Im nekid... lol. I hope you liked your movie.

Michael - I'll stir your loins anytime there baby. yummy, yummy. YOu have a good weekend too...

Varla darlin - yes actually I was thinking of you and PunkAssBitch and Ozzily Bean when I wrote this. (and of course SLOTH). You guys inspired me by your nasty talkin. Plus your in SF going to Gay Pride week, Im so jealous, now there is a PARTY! I wish you were in T-Town now, we must have been separated at birth, but like passing trains our roads havent crossed... until now online. When I come to visit SF again, I will definately look you up.

Tricia - if I give you my address will you come over and play? LOL. Wish I had something to do tonight besides hang out in this hole in the wall town. I think I'll pass and just stay home and geek it out.
-I agree with your post to JP. Men get so squirmish at the thought of two men. They also can be the most homophobic and intolerant. I wish Kev didnt live in Malasia and we could get his opinion on this? Kev, when you get online please help us out with this one. Why do "straight" men fear gayness? What frightens them so? I think they are afraid of the spectrum that lies in us all. We all have some tendencies, I mean a blow job is a blow job right? And anal sex feels soooo good. I still think two guys kissing is sexy. But then I am a fag hag, and always will be.

Jenn - you are way to friggin cool. Just a beautiful person all the way around. I think we can all appreciate the beauty in women. And who knows better how to please a woman, than another woman? Men are just too damn cute to ever give up.

Andy - thanks for stoppin by. Are you feelin Randy? (sorry couldnt resist there)

Jackson - you can ruffle my feathers any day... MEOW! Madonna was very cool in the 80's when I liked her. Im not too into her anymore. That was what like 20 years ago? Brittany spears is pathetic... gross. But back in the 80's Madonna was IT to me. I was another sheep following her lead. I do think it effected my view of sexuality. She pushed a lot of buttons, and really inspired a lot of us to rethink sexual taboos and restrictions. For that I say Go Grrrl!
-but yeah, now shes a bore... old news...
luv ya sexy cop man.

Vadergrrrl said...

Hi Aimee - Labels can be a bad thing, your so right. It shouldnt be about man/woman, it should be my partner at the time. Very good point. I also agree that I can never give up the penis (well the hot kind with veins and real cum). I just love the taste, smell, feeling inside... I dont think I could ever give that up. I also like the strenght of men. Drives me crazy... Thanks for rubbing it in that you have a life besides the computer. Im geekin out here tonight. Oh well, got wine, got smokes... and Im nekid... lol. I hope you liked your movie.

Michael - I'll stir your loins anytime there baby. yummy, yummy. YOu have a good weekend too...

Varla darlin - yes actually I was thinking of you and PunkAssBitch and Ozzily Bean when I wrote this. (and of course SLOTH). You guys inspired me by your nasty talkin. Plus your in SF going to Gay Pride week, Im so jealous, now there is a PARTY! I wish you were in T-Town now, we must have been separated at birth, but like passing trains our roads havent crossed... until now online. When I come to visit SF again, I will definately look you up.

Tricia - if I give you my address will you come over and play? LOL. Wish I had something to do tonight besides hang out in this hole in the wall town. I think I'll pass and just stay home and geek it out.
-I agree with your post to JP. Men get so squirmish at the thought of two men. They also can be the most homophobic and intolerant. I wish Kev didnt live in Malasia and we could get his opinion on this? Kev, when you get online please help us out with this one. Why do "straight" men fear gayness? What frightens them so? I think they are afraid of the spectrum that lies in us all. We all have some tendencies, I mean a blow job is a blow job right? And anal sex feels soooo good. I still think two guys kissing is sexy. But then I am a fag hag, and always will be.

Jenn - you are way to friggin cool. Just a beautiful person all the way around. I think we can all appreciate the beauty in women. And who knows better how to please a woman, than another woman? Men are just too damn cute to ever give up.

Andy - thanks for stoppin by. Are you feelin Randy? (sorry couldnt resist there)

Jackson - you can ruffle my feathers any day... MEOW! Madonna was very cool in the 80's when I liked her. Im not too into her anymore. That was what like 20 years ago? Brittany spears is pathetic... gross. But back in the 80's Madonna was IT to me. I was another sheep following her lead. I do think it effected my view of sexuality. She pushed a lot of buttons, and really inspired a lot of us to rethink sexual taboos and restrictions. For that I say Go Grrrl!
-but yeah, now shes a bore... old news...
luv ya sexy cop man.

Vadergrrrl said...

Tricia - great point. Im sure Jack would even watch that one (even though he is an "old" man). I loved it when Madonna and Brittany kissed. I may think Brittany is flash in the pan, but I loved how she has broken out of her virgin good girl role. - boy she's bad now, smoking cigarettes, breaking up marriages, getting married drunk in Vegas, kissing girls...
All too funny, but I love popular culture. I think Christina is sexier than Brittany. But then I like a girl who gets her clit pierced and tells the world.
-LOve ya Tricia! glad to see somone else is online tonight. Do you have instant messenger? Im vadergrrrl on yahoo.

sarahred said...

Hey Vader, love your blog- been reading it a while and it gives me stuff to chew over mentally while I'm meant to be doing something else- thankyou!

Jenn said...

Vadergrrrlie,
Yeah men are to good to give up, and thank god they are trainable!!!

Aimee said...

"Thanks for rubbing it in that you have a life besides the computer. Im geekin out here tonight. Oh well, got wine, got smokes... and Im nekid... lol. I hope you liked your movie."

I cried. I went to see Farenheit 9-11 and I cried nearly all the way through it. As I said to my sister (you know, the person with whom I can be completely candid and not worry if I'm gramatically incorrect or anything), "I fucking hate that fuck Dubbya. The stupid fuck is fucking up our fucking world. Fucking stupid fuck." Whew. How's that for eloquent?

Ok, but what I really wanted to say was, "wine, smokes & nekked you? Man--I'm comin' over there tonight!" :)

Also, next time you come to San Francisco area, you gotta promise to look me up as well--we can compare tattoos.

Hope your weekend is lovely!
a

Aimee said...

p.s. No one cares if you spell well or not; it's the thoughts and comments we come for.

Debra said...

My horribly disjointed comment.. reading down through that post, plus 53 comments is hard work!

Dave, so typicaly male! ;) But I agree, we are nice and soft and beautiful.

Madonna was/is awesome. She's pushed the buttons, and come back to look at everyone and ask if it killed them. And she's done it in a way that we've all enjoyed watchig her do it...lol.
As for your post, Vgrrrl, it is very interesting on an intelligent level. What are we all missing or not seeing in ourselves that we see and lust after in other women?

I can remember going out to our local gay bar, and having chicks hit on me all night. Then I felt a little bad because I had to explain I wasn't there to pick up, leaving outt he fact they weren't attractive to me anyhow, pretty, but no cosmic attraction needed to wander off with strangers form bars, but was still fauned over. Very flattering because I think women are the harsher judges between the two sexes.

Inanna, I almost completely agree with you, but not quite. I have had the complete girl-girl action, several times, but fo the most part, I am attracted to men when it comes to actual relationships. On the other hand, I also think that if the right person came around, the sex of the body wouldn't matter when it came down to it. As it is, my best friend, who is female, would be my life parnter if one of us were the opposite sex. She feels the same, but can't see the point or go past the idea of a relationship that isn't traditional. And really it doesn't matter, because the friendship we have is indisposable, and neither of us would ever want to destroy that through some other factor. She was shocked when she learned I had had sex with a woman, and very curious, and then went back to shocked again, but admitted she wished she were brave enough to try something so far out there from what is traditional "right".

Ang, thank you! Beauty is everywhere if we only stop to see it!

Pup, I wish i were so liberated and brave. But instead I'm sharing my little snippets and stories in Vgrrrl's blog comments...lol.

Dastard, good point. Some things are fantasies and not reality because reality would ruin them in a heartbeat. I remember a 2 guys/me treesome that should have stayed as a fantasy... live and learn though, right?

Angelina Jolie.. I just want to suck on that lower lip..lol.

Two guys kissing... all the gay couples I've known have been the cutest together, and no different then seeing a man and women kissing, or two women. Why can't you guys see that that way?

SugarV, trying to see what it's like was my reasoning for takign the big step to do it. How would I know if I never tried? Like food, or sports, or anything else. And I got to have a wonderful expirience several time sover, with the girlfriend of an incredibly hot guy from college. He brought me home to her as a "gift", and he got the added attraction of playing voyer.

Tricia, I caught that Prince reference.. love Prince!

Jenn, excenlent point! My first few times witha man, doing anything more then kissing and a little touching was all a learning expirience. But my first time witha woman was the opposite- we both knew exactly what we wanted, and how to get, and give it.

Ok, that was one hell of a long comment! lol

Vadergrrrl said...

sarared - thanks for comming by my blog. I checked out yours, great story on losing virginity. LOL.

Jenn - yes thank God men are trainable... Kinda like a puppy, you gotta clean up a lot of shit for a while. LOL

Aimee - you are way too cool. Im so jealous you saw Farenheight 911, I love michael moore. I want to see that movie so bad. GWB is such as scandalous asshole. Two of my favorite bumper sticker said "hail to the theif" and "dont blame me I voted with the majority". We have to get that ass out of office.
-I want to come to SF soooo bad. I will totally look you up. Maybe I can get out there this summer. I havent been there in years. I miss it so. My heart is totally there. I would love to move back one day here soon. THese rednecks are getting to be too much.
-thanks for the acknolegement of my spelling... I was hoping people could look through the errors and judge me more on my content. I luv ya grrrl!

-Weekend is going good here. Teenage son is off being a teenager and Im here alone. Thats okay, Ive got wine, I got smokes, I got cable tv, and my two cute pussy cats to play with. Maybe the vibrator will come in handy.. who knows. I hear my sailor boy-toy is comming back from sea soon. Cant wait for some young boy sexin.... gotta love those seamen... especially in your mouth... LOL
xoxoxoxoxoxo
YOu have a good weekend too.

Vadergrrrl said...

Debra Goddess - you always have the most incredible posts here. Very wise you are! (my yoda impersenation)
-I forgot to mention the Prince reference, I thought that was so hot when I was a kid. Purple Rain baby.... Prince is another who pushed buttons. I wounder what ever happened to Wendy and Lisa?
-Debra you are such an amazing person. I am in awe of your knowlege and worldly view of things. You definately are one AMAZING chick. I think girls like you will one day rule the world. Or at least I hope so.
-thanks for the great comments as always.

Debra said...

Rule the world? Me? Ok! Where's the reins? lol

Seriously, thanks! If I didn't love reading what you write, and hearing what you think, I wouldn't check in nearly once a day...lol. *hugs*

Keep up the awesome posts, and thoughts!

Vadergrrrl said...

Thanks Debra. Im kicking your math teacher in the balls psychically as I write this. HOw DARE he treat the Goddess like that?!?!? Doesnt he know who you are!!!1
Luv ya grrrl!

Locke said...

Addressing guy-on-guy action, I'd have to say most guys are uncomfortable with it because of the stigma involved. I also think it has to do with a lack of exposure. Girl on girl action seems to be everywhere, where guy on guy is not.

Much like Vadergrrrl, I didn't become sexually liberated until well out of highschool. As I traveled around the US and became exposed to a lot of different people and cultures I learned just how sheltered and small-minded I really was. It forced me to start looking at everything I thought I believed to see if it was genuine or obligatory. My sexuality was one of these.

I started thinking, what if it's not bad or gross or immoral? What if, like everything else in life, it's just another flavor to try? When I got the opportunity to experiment, I took it. And I liked it. I'm still extremely attracted to women, but I also enjoy the men too. I don't believe I could ever have a RELATIONSHIP with a guy (quite frankly ladies, I don't see how you can either), but sex and relationships are hardly synonymous.

Unfortunately, it is FAR less acceptable for a guy to be bi than it is for the ladies...perhaps one day we'll find our own liberation.

Debra said...

hee hee Keep kicking him in the balls, because I swear I'm gonna go crazy if I have to wait a year for a math class! Grrrr!

Locke, (I really, really hope I remembered your posting name right, slow page loading) I think it also depends on your social cliche. I spent a lot of time with exclusively straight friends. The few bisexual people that wandered through our circle were frowned on, but not in a way that was really obvious. Just enough to make our group not quite the right fit for them.

Later on, I ended up in a circle of almost exclusively gay people, with a good handful of bisexuals mixed in. I was a rarity because I didn't claim a label, and consider myself straight simply because my strongest inclination is towards men.

But the guys who were bi had their boyfriends and girlfriends, and all were accepted in the cliche. Outside of it of course was a different story.

Heck, less then half a milk form our local gay bar is another bar that is well known for making gay men turn up dead in a hurry, as well as black men. I can't remember if I posted what I learned about that bar in the other post I mentioned in in or not though- that the owner of the cowboy bar's wife left him for a woman, and he helped them buy the gay bar? Ok that she can have her cake, but a man can't lest he wants to be dead. :(

I think I got off topic there.... that Goddess bit must have gone to my head...lol.

Debra said...

Half a milk? Half a mile! lol

The Oracle said...

An excellent treatment of the subject. Reads more like a magazine article than a blog entry. Damn fine piece of work.

CountChocula said...

About a year ago, my girlfriend Shannon and I are at one of the few remaining restaurants in this city that you could still smoke in, so of course, it became a refuge. We sit down at our table and as I am taking my jacket off she says as she's staring at my breasteses, "Chrrrist, you brought out the big guns today! I'd borrow that shirt if it wasn't for my sad little empty mittens", and I said "Yup, I unleashed the hounds today", and we look to the right and there is our waiter standing there looking completely aghast. Through his thick accent he says "You should not talk to friend that vay, that is your friend, she don't like that". So Shannon being ever the instigator says "wha? she doesn't care, see?" and promptly reaches over for a good honk, and I'm sitting there not caring a bit that i'd just been goosed (not the first time she has done this) and this poor guy just got redder and more mortified and hightailed it to get our coffee.

Is this an odd thing? I mean, she's not attracted to me, i'm not attracted to her, we're just..like that, as I think most best girlfriends are. I just don't see anything weird in complimenting another woman, even if it is about her big her boobs are looking that day, and that's why i'm glad to be one. :)

Aimee said...

Count--an odd thing? Nah, I don't think so. Wouldn't it be great if we were all so comfortable with each other? I have had some galpals with whom I could be touchy like that, but my best friend now...hmmmm...nope, couldn't imagine that would be ok with her. Bummer, too, 'cause she's cute. ;)

Vadergrrrl said...

Locke - wow, Im very turned on by your post. Thanks for the commentary from a male perspective. I belive more men feel the way you do. Especially when they are young boys, you here so much about boys playing "criss cross applesauce" or mutually masturbating, or whatever. I think its more common than guys admit. Thanks so much for commenting.

Debra- I love all your posts. Yes I read about your local bar that kills young black men, or effeminate men. Its strange to me that it is so close to the "gay" bar. There is no gay bar here in Bremerton. Because of the strong military influence, it is very homophobic. Lesbiansism is okay, and girl on girl action. Girls do it here for attention, to rial up the troops and the townies, but there is no real liberation here. There are some bull-dyke lesbian types, lots of them, but I think you find that in every blue colar town, its more acceptable to macho men types. Gay males.. well they get the hell out of here fast, if they dont commit suicide as a teenager before escaping. makes me really sad.

Oracle - I love it when you come by. Thanks for your comment. I take a lot of pride in your kind words, considering your background.

Count Louvisa - You are just one fun loving cool ass chick! I think when I meet ya, I may goose ya too, and your hubby. LOL. Isnt it nice being liberated (and cynical). Luv ya sis.

Aimee - You are officially linked on my blog. I agree, I cant be like that with a lot of my girlfriends. Especially the ones I know from high school. Some of my friends are more liberated and touchy touchy than others. Some, its like we are sisters... and ewwwww gross incest.

Tricia said...

Damn Grrrlfriend... I'm DemonQueen996 on AOL... I don't have yahoo! shit!
You need to download AOL... Jenn and I play dirty chat games ALL NIGHT LONG!

Vadergrrrl said...

Well IM officially a "badge bunny" now. whooo hooo. Never thought I would hear that one.
Check out jacks blog for the dirty details...
http://jackstexasmusic.blogspot.com/

sometimes its sooo fun to be bad....

HOnestly, we do RESPECT jack for his serious cop tales.... can we help it if we just have fanasies about a man with a big gun, handcuffs, and who knows how to hog tie? Ooooh baby...

Maddy said...

Well, it's official now, Vgrrl you are seriously rivalling TJ's Place for most logs. I guess it's true, love makes the world go 'round, and there will be little else more interesting to us all than sex, sex and more sex!
What kinds of sex practices can we talk about next Vgrrl? I don't know about anyone else, but I'm sure learning about modern mores on this and other blogs -unless of course, these stories are all fantasies and wishful thinking.

Tricia said...

Guess you didn't notice Maddy...you were comment 69.
Just thought I would point that out... couldn't resist. Heheh

Vadergrrrl said...

69 whooo - hooo Maddy you are the winner.
I love how on the masturbation post, there is 60 comments....
ya baby... fun position. But I find it hard to concentrate when your about to cum and you have a dick in your mouth. LOL

Avuncular 1 said...

Wow, this post is still going. Awesome. First I would like to ask how many people have successfuly completed the 69 position? I said completed. As in NOT FOREPLAY. I think it's almost an urban legend. The biggest reason is, as Vader said, CONCENTRATION, another reason is that due to differences in body-types, the parts don't alway match up.

Also, I have been giving the "bi" issue more thought (helped by some of excellent comments above) and in defense of bisexuals I have changed my mind. I now think that it is possible for a person to claim that they are a bisexual before ever participating in same-sex activities (or any activities), just as heterosexuals and homosexuals can know who they are before having any sex. Yes I still think that many do fake it but I suppose we should give them the benefit of the doubt. Another attitude about bisexuals that bothers me is that they are sluts, and will do anyone or anything. I know both gay and straight people that have this disturbing opinion. Bisexuals can be as freaky or as monogamous as anyone else. My feeling is that if you are in an LTR and have not come to an agreement with your partner about the openess of your relationship (i.e. keeping it a secret) then you are cheating regardless of the gender of your paramour.
I agree with the comment above about kids experimenting a little when they hit puberty. I think most do to some extent or another and if they didn't they are lying. And definitely I could only have an emotional relationship with a woman. There is just something so, I don't know, I just love 'em amd their womanly ways. I don't want to use yin & yang but, for me personally, I feel they are complimentary (and so keep me from being more of a dumbass). but Dylan McDermott, yeah, I'd hit that.

Oh, and Vader, Sloth would have totally dug this post. You might have to do a rerun when she gets back.

Aimee said...

Whew--that was a mouthful, Dastard! All very well said. (Oh, and I SOOOO agree about Dylan McDermott!)

Michael Wriston said...

I've been stalking your journal for a couple of days now, and I must say, reading your posts has been a very enjoyable experience. I love what you write. I love how open you are when you write.

Also, I've been agreeing whole-heartedly with a lot of your sexual posts lately. About the whole getting to know what you like, exploring, stuff like that. To be honest, I've been utilizing those techniques in my own relationship, and the experience of sexuality has increased almost tenfold.

Just saying that I appreciate your posts, and appreciate how thought-provoking they are.

Greg said...

My Goal: To be able to write a post titled "Everything I ever need to know about sex I learned from Vadergrrrl!"

The Dave said...

Why has everything today either involved things coming in or going out of my ass?

-Eric Cartman

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